M-48 tank survivability

M-48 TANK SURVIVABILITY

On the previous version of Fields of Fire Relaoded, I had an ongoing thread I called Random Historical Notes. I may revive that for our new FoF.

Here is something like I would have put in that thread at the time. It comes from a book I am now reading,Snedeker,The Blackhorse in Vietnam. The account is from pages 52 and 53. Some background material precedes it by a few pages.

In the 30 minute ambush on 21 May 1967 of an 11th Armored Cavalry Regiment convoy, the lone M-48 tank of the convoy was hit by 30 anti-tank rounds. Fourteen penetrated its armor. Many gouged the turret and hull where they glanced off. Both the loader and driver were seriously wounded early on. Both machine guns, the main gun range finder and sight, and the radios were knocked out. The tank itself was in a ditch, immobile. Nonetheless, the TC and gunner continued to fight the tank until relief forces came on the scene. The anti-tank weapons included RPG2s and recoilless rifles. There may have been both 57mm and 75mm recoilless rifles involved. As Darby pointed out, unlike WWII, it was not uncommon for the crews of armored vehicles in Vietnam to continue to fight their vehicles even after they have been shot up pretty badly. So if your rules are all or nothing on a hit on an armored vehicle, you might want to try a modification. Also, RPG7s were much more effective than the RPG2s the 5th VC Division had at this time.

Those takers wouldn't quit!

Tom

I think that you are right although perhaps it depends on the battle being fought.

At Hue one Patton was put out of action by RPG. The first round removed the head of the commander who was looking out of the turret. The second went into the side of the turret. This destroyed the vehicle. There is also reference to a Patton destroyed and being flipped upside down. Presumably an IED . From what I have read the crews in Hue seem to have abandoned the brewed up vehicles. Presumably because friendly forces were in the area to rescue them.

I am just finishing a book on Operation Starlight and there is an interesting section on a column of Amtracks getting ambushed. They were attacked for about 24 hours by countless RPG's. recoiless rifles, petrol, grenades, an 82mm mortar, etc. Many of the crew and passengers were killed and because the VC were not under threat from a Marine relief force they wandered around casually taking souvenirs, and trying to get into some of the vehicles. The Marines either trapped inside or defending from outside stayed put and kept fighting. The relief finally found their position and rescued them. At no time did any Marine surrender as they knew they would be killed.

What is interesting is that the Amtraks were not that heavily armoured but they were not brewed up. After the battle they were all recovered and repaired. Only one was beyond the recovery and is still there as a memorial.

Taking Garry Owens point it does make each armoured vehicle a story in itself rather than a straight hit or miss situation.

Paul@ Empress wrote:What is interesting is that the Amtraks were not that heavily armoured but they were not brewed up.   

Amtraks tended to burn when they hit mines as their fuel tanks were on the bottom, which is why you see so many pictured of grunts riding on top.  And they hit a LOT of mines.
My uncle was in 1st and 3rd tanks (USMC) over 2 tours starting as a loader and ending a TC and platoon SGT.  He only lost 2 crewmen over 2 tours, both to RPG-7 hits.  He said they never bailed out of their tank other than the time a wasp nest was knocked into it by one of the antennas as they were going under a tree, while they were under fire no less!
During his 2nd tour he had his flame tank hit 8 times by RPGs in one battle.  The first strike killed his gunner and wrecked his seat.  Other damage was a lost bogie, 2 road wheels on one side (but not detracked), a vision block, and their cooler of food and water.  The last hit damaged the finals drives and immobilized them for a bit, but they kept fighting it.
From everything he's told me his unit never bailed out and left a tank, it just wasn't done, mostly as there was nowhere to go, no frontlines to reach.  And no one wanted to be captured.